S1:E8 | Big Nonprofit Lessons for Smaller Nonprofits B
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[00:00:31] Jeremy: Welcome to today's episode where we will be talking about the digital fundraising lessons learned from one big nonprofit and how these lessons benefit any size nonprofit.
[00:00:41] Jeremy: Before we get started, make sure you tap click or smash the follow or subscribe button so that you'll be notified when each new episode drops.
[00:00:49] Jeremy: The title of this episode is fundraising in the
[00:00:51] Jeremy: digital age size matters
[00:00:53] Jeremy: And my guest is Vernicia Respress. A little bit about her. She's a digital marketing leader with 19 plus years of [00:01:00] experience in digital fundraising
[00:01:02] Jeremy: and has helped to raise over
[00:01:03] Jeremy: $150 million. She's also, won an award
[00:01:07] Jeremy: for national coalition of a hundred black women.
[00:01:09] Jeremy: Her career spans amazing nonprofits like the American Cancer Society, the Carter Center, and now Habitat for Humanity. Welcome to this episode, Vernicia.
[00:01:19] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Hi there. I'm glad to be here. Jeremy. Thanks for having me.
[00:01:22] Jeremy: Yeah I gave a little bit
[00:01:23] Jeremy: of an intro. Tell us a little bit about yourself, who you are and what your role is with Habitat.
[00:01:28] Vernicia: Sure, I'm born and raised in Atlanta, Georgia, that's why you see all the trees and everything surrounding me here. I've been at Habitat since about 2012, at this point that's, a little over a decade, almost 12 years. And I just have a love for the non profit community.
[00:01:43] Vernicia: space, obviously, since this is my third nonprofit. I'm one of those kind of left brain, right brain people where by day I focus on digital fundraising and by night I'm an artist and creative. I leverage both of those in my day to day work here at Habitat.
[00:01:58] Jeremy: birds of a feather. I [00:02:00] feel very the same. There's this creative side and then there's just analytic strategic side. I see you, I recognize
[00:02:06] Jeremy: you. This is going to be a great conversation. But going back to, your career, when you started, what inspired you to get involved with nonprofits?
[00:02:12] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Let's see. I actually started out in the graphic design and web design space.
[00:02:17] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And I owned a small business. I was much younger than, and I was like, Oh my gosh, there's so much responsibility with being an entrepreneur. What can I do? What kind of work can I do that will be gratifying and allow me to explore creatively in a digital space? That's Just about 20 years ago.
[00:02:33] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: That's when we were just getting into, everyday people learning about web design and things like that. The nonprofit space really hadn't ventured into a lot of digital fundraising and things like that at the time. I'm happy to say that they allowed me to come in and, and I guess experiment and learn and build programs and things like that. My career just evolved from there.
[00:02:52] Jeremy: That's awesome. You're with Habitat now. Talk about what Habitat means to you.
[00:02:57] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: What Habitat means to me? Oh my [00:03:00] gosh. It is , as you probably know, a very big organization that a lot of people are familiar with, and there's the volunteer piece.
[00:03:07] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: My attachment with Habitat before, long before I worked there, was really being a volunteer and building homes. And at that point, I hadn't thought about actually working at the organization. But eventually, my relationship with Habitat evolved into become an employee. It's a full circle moment growing up in Atlanta, knowing that there were always housing needs and that I didn't really have opportunities to grow up in a home myself.
[00:03:31] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I feel very connected to the mission. I'm glad to work there and then provide a safe place to live or help provide a safe place to live for other families.
[00:03:39] Jeremy: Yeah. Don't you love
[00:03:40] Jeremy: those full circle moments of life,
[00:03:42] Jeremy: how early you experienced one end of the spectrum and then you live and then you're actually on the other end of that, whether you're helping other people
[00:03:50] Jeremy: or playing some kind of role in someone having
[00:03:53] Jeremy: housing
[00:03:53] Jeremy: and you're involved in that kind
[00:03:56] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Exactly. Exactly. And I didn't even see it at the time, but when I sit in [00:04:00] meetings and hear from, families and single moms and things like that, reminds me of my background I'm glad to be on the other side of it.
[00:04:06] Jeremy: Yeah, And what would be one thing that you would say that most people wouldn't know about Habitat for Humanity?
[00:04:13] Vernicia: One thing, let's see I'm going to try to focus on one thing. I think there's two things, but I'll focus one of them. Okay. can go with two. Okay. All right. One is that it's a hand up and not a handout with families. I think a lot of people assume we just give away the homes. You can just win it or apply and we just give it away.
[00:04:33] Vernicia: The idea of sweat equity and, when folks are volunteering on these sites, the families have their sleeves rolled up and they are participating in all sorts of ways. I think that's one thing that a lot of people don't realize and that our programs are complex and not just, Like I said, giveaways there's education programs on financial management and all of that. There's that and I think the other piece is that we're an international organization. A lot of our U. S. donors and [00:05:00] supporters and volunteers I think some of the visuals that people see, they don't realize that we're all over the world. I would say those are the two things that, a lot of people don't really know.
[00:05:08] Jeremy: I think what people especially here in the United States They are very narrowly focused on maybe what's in their city and maybe they don't realize it's actually all over the country much less The
[00:05:17] Jeremy: whole world but the
[00:05:18] Jeremy: impact
[00:05:19] Jeremy: is
[00:05:19] Jeremy: tremendous
[00:05:20] Jeremy: and Some
[00:05:21] Jeremy: of the things
[00:05:21] Jeremy: I've learned about Habitat are really amazing in terms of also
[00:05:24] Jeremy: their voice being involved in policies that are made to help shape housing, which is really
[00:05:29] Jeremy: such a crisis right now. I certainly appreciate that.
[00:05:31] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Yeah, and innovation as well. The different ways of building housing and sustainability and things like that. It's very interesting, the portfolio of work that Habitat has going on. That's
[00:05:42] Jeremy: That's great. You've been in fundraising for a little
[00:05:44] Jeremy: bit now.
[00:05:45] Jeremy: Tell me about a fundraising campaign that you were
[00:05:48] Jeremy: proud to be a part of,
[00:05:49] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Oh my gosh. Let's see. I've experienced so many over the years. I would say GivingTuesday is a interesting one to me because I was more than [00:06:00] halfway through my career before GivingTuesday even existed.
[00:06:02] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: When I heard about the campaign and there's just, So many different organizations pulling together and focusing on one particular day. Of course there are matches and things like that, but I was like, now, how is that going to work? I don't know about it, but I said, I'll go ahead and participate.
[00:06:15] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: To see giving Tuesday evolve from basically a new concept to something that kind of is a integrated campaign that now we include the mail and we have celebrity engagement now and we're doing matches. We have major donors that are offering a match with giving Tuesday. It has become almost a million dollar a day campaign.
[00:06:35] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I would say that's one that is very interesting to me and excited to be a part of it.
[00:06:40] Jeremy: Yeah. Let's talk a little more about giving Tuesday because
[00:06:45] Jeremy: nonprofits that I speak
[00:06:46] Jeremy: with, some are very pro
[00:06:48] Jeremy: giving
[00:06:48] Jeremy: Tuesday
[00:06:49] Jeremy: and some are like,
[00:06:50] Jeremy: I'm not going to do giving
[00:06:51] Jeremy: Tuesday.
[00:06:51] Jeremy: There's too much competition. We've tried It
[00:06:54] Jeremy: before. It didn't work. And of course these are all different sizes of nonprofits, small, [00:07:00] and large.
[00:07:00] Jeremy: What would you say to an organization that didn't have success with giving Tuesday?
[00:07:06] Vernicia: It's tough. I think I certainly can sympathize. That was my first response when I heard about Giving Tuesday.
[00:07:12] Vernicia: Honestly, I said, I'm not going to participate. It's not going to go anywhere. But then I was like let's try it. I would say, try to lean into it, especially in the digital space, because it's not as expensive as the mail. If it's an organization that has tried it, and maybe tried it in multiple channels, they may want to look at the channel piece.
[00:07:30] Vernicia: Because if you're integrating mail, and there's so much cost associated with it, and there's the timing issue, that could be a little bit of a challenge. I would say don't give up on it, but really look at where are you with this? Are you in social media? Are you an email? And then there's also the celebrity engagement piece and adding in a match.
[00:07:48] Vernicia: We went to our major giving team and said, Hey, can you find someone to help us boost this campaign? That's really one of the main campaigns where we go across having a match and [00:08:00] celebrity engagement, all of that kind of folded in together. I would say look at some of those other pieces and see if you can't boost the campaign and boost engagement with it.
[00:08:08] Jeremy: Yeah.
[00:08:08] Jeremy: And that's Really a good idea because
[00:08:10] Jeremy: the nonprofits that I've talked to that didn't have success, maybe they just sent out a couple
[00:08:15] Jeremy: of
[00:08:15] Jeremy: emails or posted a
[00:08:17] Jeremy: little bit on social media, and that's not going to really be enough on giving Tuesday. And one of the
[00:08:24] Jeremy: things that you'd mentioned Habitat
[00:08:25] Jeremy: does that I've seen other organizations
[00:08:27] Jeremy: do that really
[00:08:28] Jeremy: helps with giving Tuesday is a match.
[00:08:30] Jeremy: And I'm always telling nonprofits, if you can get a match
[00:08:33] Jeremy: That can be a huge game changer with how you're giving Tuesday
[00:08:36] Jeremy: works
[00:08:37] Jeremy: because people are
[00:08:38] Jeremy: already giving
[00:08:38] Jeremy: on that day. They know it's giving Tuesday. And if they have to choose between which nonprofit they're going to
[00:08:44] Jeremy: give to but over here, they're matching my gift.
[00:08:47] Jeremy: That means my gift will go twice, sometimes three, four times, depending on the size of the match. Here's the money I was
[00:08:53] Jeremy: going to give This one has a better quote unquote offer for me and I can make more that's a game changer. you said that
[00:08:59] Jeremy: [00:09:00] I'm, I've really been trying to get a lot of nonprofits
[00:09:02] Jeremy: to do, which is add that
[00:09:03] Jeremy: direct mail piece, even if it's just like a save the date postcard
[00:09:07] Jeremy: and nobody's taken me up on it
[00:09:09] Jeremy: so far, but
[00:09:10] Jeremy: it sounds like
[00:09:11] Jeremy: Habitat has done something like
[00:09:12] Jeremy: that.
[00:09:12] Jeremy: Are you able to talk about how
[00:09:14] Jeremy: that's helped to increase campaigns?
[00:09:16] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I think it's tricky. We, cause like I said, with mail, there's costs, and if you're mailing millions of pieces and then you don't know exactly when it's going to land, given that. Tuesday is on Tuesday. I can see both sides of the coin with that one.
[00:09:31] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I would say our best approach is to opt with inserts with just mail inserts that list a couple of things that are coming up. Because giving Tuesday is basically around year end, which I could see why that makes people nervous. Especially this year is coming up in December. We raise almost half of our revenue in December in digital space. I would say using mail inserts is probably best. And also there's telemarketing and, some scripts you can put together for that as well. That's probably what I would suggest is trying some inserts, [00:10:00] postcards.
[00:10:00] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: There's also newsletters as well. It just depends on the costs and the organization and what, how they're able to integrate that message.
[00:10:07] Jeremy: Yeah,
[00:10:08] Jeremy: and I'm a big proponent of just doing a save the date weeks in advance. That way you don't have to worry about it hitting the week of giving Tuesday. That way you know is coming, put a QR code on there that already goes to your donation page
[00:10:20] Jeremy: and you'll start to get some of those donations in early.
[00:10:23] Jeremy: And using a postcard would be relatively inexpensive compared to a letter or like that.
[00:10:28] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: something I think that's a great idea
[00:10:29] Jeremy: Yeah, and I
[00:10:29] Jeremy: like the influencer piece
[00:10:31] Jeremy: as well That's an area
[00:10:32] Jeremy: that a lot of small and medium sized nonprofits struggle with because of their size. They think, we can't get this celebrity or this person.
[00:10:41] Jeremy: And you don't always need to get the big names. You
[00:10:43] Jeremy: can always tap into local influencers
[00:10:46] Jeremy: Or other people in your community that can be an
[00:10:49] Jeremy: advocate for you. See who's in your network. who's popular in your area or who on social media is not a huge name, but a micro influencer.
[00:10:56] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: influencer. Yeah. You can also, generate engagement campaigns [00:11:00] as well. You may have advocates or super donors right within your own list of donors that could be willing to help boost the campaign as well. There's lots that you can do in that regard.
[00:11:09] Jeremy: Yeah.
[00:11:10] Jeremy: cool. Let's talk about monthly
[00:11:11] Jeremy: giving
[00:11:12] Jeremy: what role does
[00:11:14] Jeremy: monthly giving play
[00:11:15] Jeremy: with
[00:11:15] Jeremy: habitat?
[00:11:17] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Monthly giving plays a huge role with Habitat and probably most nonprofits to be honest. And we have a robust program. A lot of our monthly givers are dual channel donors.
[00:11:29] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: They're both offline and online. It plays a significant role in our strategy and, we've got to be looking at that audience as well as other audiences and developing campaigns for them as well. We've also in addition to just fundraising campaigns with monthly givers, We like to do cultivation campaigns with them as well.
[00:11:47] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And we've done things like spotlight advocates are super supporters of Habitat as well. That's been, some of our fun campaigns, just making sure we're not always just asking for money,
[00:11:56] Jeremy: Yeah,
[00:11:56] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: are
[00:11:57] Jeremy: that needs to be struck with [00:12:00] fundraising. And we're so keyed in on donations and not wanting to fill up the email or the inbox with too many emails. Every email that sends out needs to count, but also you need to balance it out with those affirmational and cultivation emails, because every time someone hears from you, if your hand is out, then it can be a turnoff.
[00:12:19] Jeremy: It's like having a friend or relative or someone, see him coming around, you're like,
[00:12:23] Jeremy: oh, here comes
[00:12:24] Jeremy: such and such. They're going to ask me for
[00:12:25] Jeremy: 5
[00:12:26] Jeremy: or they need some
[00:12:27] Jeremy: help. You gotta make the donors feel
[00:12:28] Jeremy: good about what they've helped you accomplish as an
[00:12:30] Jeremy: organization.
[00:12:31] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Yeah. And we also have to do, technical projects and optimize our donation forms testing the various ask strings for our monthly donors, just trying to find new ways to engage with them. Our auto responders. And another thing that we continue to try to evolve is self service options for hope builders as well.
[00:12:51] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: If they need to. update their credit card and things like that. Just looking at the whole technical landscape and making sure that experience is good as credit cards expire and [00:13:00] change and things like that. Lots goes into our hope builder program, which is our monthly given program is called hope builders.
[00:13:05] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And it continues to evolve for sure.
[00:13:08] Jeremy: Good. Good.
[00:13:08] Jeremy: Vernicia, let's talk a little bit about testing for a minute.
[00:13:12] Jeremy: There's so many
[00:13:13] Jeremy: different tests
[00:13:13] Jeremy: with digital and
[00:13:14] Jeremy: I'm sure Habitat probably is
[00:13:16] Jeremy: testing
[00:13:17] Jeremy: a lot of different aspects of
[00:13:18] Jeremy: digital. When you look back at
[00:13:20] Jeremy: either what you're testing now or
[00:13:21] Jeremy: previously, is
[00:13:22] Jeremy: there anything that surprised you
[00:13:24] Jeremy: about what you've
[00:13:25] Jeremy: tested?
[00:13:27] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Sure one thing that surprised me because we always testing things within email we're always testing several components of our donation forms. What surprised me was our standard form versus a new kind of fancy design. I'll use the. The term fancy more broadly but I was so surprised that our audience really stuck to the core form design that we already had.
[00:13:51] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: In our case we have a little bit of an older demographic audience and I'm making some assumptions there, but we have people that have been with us for many [00:14:00] years and we found out, what? Evolving the form too quickly doesn't necessarily win. We've had to test different things within the form.
[00:14:08] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: We can test the field changes and things like that, but totally overhaul on the design doesn't necessarily work in our case. We'll continue to test it, but that certainly surprised me. And that let me know, you can't make assumptions about what people like. It's not always the new shiny thing.
[00:14:23] Jeremy: Yeah.
[00:14:23] Jeremy: And when you talk about the
[00:14:25] Jeremy: fancy things, was it
[00:14:26] Jeremy: Imagery or what were some of those
[00:14:28] Jeremy: things? Okay.
[00:14:29] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It was some imagery some color changes and Maybe move in some fields around. We have a tribute giving program, changing the placement of that button. And even some things that we thought, would just move the form forward until in terms of more sleek design.
[00:14:46] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It could be font changes in the sizes of the boxes, things like that. Too much change at one time seems to be I wouldn't say necessarily overwhelming, but it didn't necessarily win. You just can't assume that that the design will win.
[00:14:58] Jeremy: yeah, and that's
[00:14:59] Jeremy: really
[00:14:59] Jeremy: [00:15:00] interesting
[00:15:00] Jeremy: because
[00:15:00] Jeremy: I know within email a lot
[00:15:02] Jeremy: of times the more over designed it is,
[00:15:04] Jeremy: the lower it can perform because it looks too
[00:15:06] Jeremy: much like
[00:15:07] Jeremy: marketing, but from a donation
[00:15:08] Jeremy: perspective.
[00:15:10] Jeremy: I love to hear this about what Habitat experience has been because
[00:15:13] Jeremy: I think for other organizations it may work. I think been around a long time,
[00:15:18] Jeremy: They're a legacy non profit.
[00:15:20] Jeremy: They have tons and tons of donors who are used to seeing
[00:15:23] Jeremy: things a certain way. I wonder if that same test was
[00:15:25] Jeremy: done with smaller, medium sized, it may
[00:15:28] Jeremy: work for their donors because they're not so used to
[00:15:31] Jeremy: the way a
[00:15:32] Jeremy: form looks. I say all that
[00:15:33] Jeremy: to say.
[00:15:34] Jeremy: This is great information
[00:15:36] Jeremy: and what I want
[00:15:37] Jeremy: people
[00:15:37] Jeremy: to do is take this and
[00:15:38] Jeremy: use it as
[00:15:39] Jeremy: a data point and test it, because
[00:15:41] Jeremy: what's being
[00:15:42] Jeremy: said about Habitat
[00:15:43] Jeremy: may not apply for you.
[00:15:45] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And we retest, just because we, obviously just because we land in one place, times continue to change, technology continues to change.
[00:15:53] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And there may be other times that we try it again and it works, but for us the base form has worked for a [00:16:00] really long time for us. We've had to make changes within
[00:16:02] Jeremy: Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's one of
[00:16:04] Jeremy: the most important
[00:16:05] Jeremy: facets of fundraising to
[00:16:08] Jeremy: test is
[00:16:08] Jeremy: that donation form.
[00:16:10] Jeremy: Yes, you can risk revenue,
[00:16:12] Jeremy: but you can also make really small
[00:16:13] Jeremy: tweaks and increase revenue
[00:16:15] Jeremy: significantly.
[00:16:16] Jeremy: Continuing the test, that makes a
[00:16:17] Jeremy: lot of sense, really for any and especially one of the size of Habitat.
[00:16:22] Jeremy: Let's talk about you and fundraising. What is your favorite thing about fundraising?
[00:16:28] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: My favorite thing about fundraising. I would say connecting the dots. Between, our work and the family impact, we use quite a bit of family stories in our content that we mail out.
[00:16:41] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And not every organization has the benefit of having so many family stories and so much impact. But that's one of my favorite things, to hear how someone's life has changed because they were in a home or someone's life has changed because they got to volunteer or looking at the Carter work project and things like that.
[00:16:58] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: That's. That's my favorite thing. It's like being [00:17:00] connected to the mission, even though I'm at the international office and not a local affiliate. I'm, always so excited to be able to see the impact of our work.
[00:17:09] Jeremy: Yeah.
[00:17:09] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: my favorite part of it.
[00:17:11] Jeremy: Yeah. And what would you
[00:17:13] Jeremy: say
[00:17:13] Jeremy: some of the
[00:17:14] Jeremy: biggest lessons
[00:17:15] Jeremy: that you've
[00:17:15] Jeremy: learned personally and digital
[00:17:17] Jeremy: fundraising over the
[00:17:18] Jeremy: years?
[00:17:18] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Interesting. Patience. I can be a little on the techie nerdy side, but I can also be really creative and experimental. And a lot of people, such as myself that, work for nonprofits and you really want to make change and do as much impact as you can.
[00:17:35] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: But. The system doesn't always work that quickly, and there's a lot of pieces that are very important that you have to consider. There's privacy laws and, all sorts of things like that. Working in a digital space has been interesting to see it all evolve over time. We have the different platforms, the email platforms that have different rules and, you have to look out for spam and things like that.
[00:17:55] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: There's been interesting lessons along the way. But definitely have to be [00:18:00] patient and diligent when there's a goal in mind.
[00:18:02] Jeremy: Yeah, and that's a good point. And I think that stands
[00:18:05] Jeremy: true
[00:18:05] Jeremy: for most sizes of
[00:18:07] Jeremy: nonprofits. I think it can
[00:18:08] Jeremy: be more challenging with larger nonprofits, the size of
[00:18:11] Jeremy: a habitat,
[00:18:11] Jeremy: because there's so many layers and decision
[00:18:13] Jeremy: makers and buy in that you
[00:18:15] Jeremy: have
[00:18:15] Jeremy: to get. But even from a smaller, medium
[00:18:17] Jeremy: sized nonprofit,
[00:18:18] Jeremy: Because there's so many different angles you
[00:18:20] Jeremy: can
[00:18:21] Jeremy: hit with digital from the
[00:18:22] Jeremy: marketing channels to new
[00:18:23] Jeremy: technology and innovation and
[00:18:25] Jeremy: platforms And when new things come out, how do you
[00:18:28] Jeremy: not get shiny button syndrome? I
[00:18:30] Jeremy: want to try this. I want to try
[00:18:31] Jeremy: that.
[00:18:32] Jeremy: And even for the smaller, medium
[00:18:33] Jeremy: sized nonprofits, they still have
[00:18:34] Jeremy: a board that they have to answer to even though you may have this good idea they don't work at a nonprofit the size of Habitat,
[00:18:41] Jeremy: but you still have to basically
[00:18:42] Jeremy: sell your ideas in and that
[00:18:44] Jeremy: investment. and I think a lot of people listening to this now we'll
[00:18:48] Jeremy: share your frustration with some of that.
[00:18:50] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: that. Yeah. Yeah. And I would say the other piece, as creative as I love to be, there's the data piece. Our fundraising is only as good as our data. That's a lesson that you don't want to [00:19:00] learn too much, as creative as an idea might be, or a channel may be knowing that your data has got to be right, if you're going to do like an upgrade campaign or a recurring campaign, you understanding that giving history. You can really engage with donors properly is important as well.
[00:19:15] Jeremy: And from that data standpoint
[00:19:17] Jeremy: and wanting to
[00:19:19] Jeremy: push the boundaries, I remember earlier in my nonprofit
[00:19:21] Jeremy: career, I was working,
[00:19:23] Jeremy: doing some work with this humanitarian
[00:19:25] Jeremy: organization,
[00:19:26] Jeremy: and I was looking at these
[00:19:27] Jeremy: direct mail pieces and it was a black and
[00:19:29] Jeremy: white image And this lady that
[00:19:31] Jeremy: was in there had this old
[00:19:33] Jeremy: bouffant hairstyle from
[00:19:35] Jeremy: probably the
[00:19:36] Jeremy: late eighties, early
[00:19:37] Jeremy: nineties.
[00:19:38] Jeremy: And , we were well into the
[00:19:39] Jeremy: two
[00:19:39] Jeremy: thousands at this
[00:19:40] Jeremy: point. And
[00:19:42] Jeremy: I remember talking to the
[00:19:43] Jeremy: account team, like, why are we still sending this email? this
[00:19:45] Jeremy: looks dated.
[00:19:47] Jeremy: And they're like, Jeremy,
[00:19:48] Jeremy: we've
[00:19:48] Jeremy: tested this every year we try to beat
[00:19:50] Jeremy: this image And
[00:19:52] Jeremy: it doesn't matter what image
[00:19:53] Jeremy: we use. This image always
[00:19:55] Jeremy: wins. And it just blew my mind.
[00:19:57] Jeremy: I don't understand
[00:19:58] Jeremy: why that works. I don't know if it's a [00:20:00] nostalgia thing. People are used to seeing this or maybe they
[00:20:02] Jeremy: see it and it
[00:20:04] Jeremy: I have no idea.
[00:20:05] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It's so interesting. We've had things like that happen to, even with signers, you switch up the signers, people's longstanding relationship with your organization, you gotta be careful about that.
[00:20:16] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Yes, totally agree and Yeah, it's like always test before you move into what that decision is. You may have a great idea but always test into it because as great as an
[00:20:25] Jeremy: idea
[00:20:26] Jeremy: as it is, it may actually end up
[00:20:28] Jeremy: losing money
[00:20:29] Jeremy: for you
[00:20:29] Jeremy: and not
[00:20:30] Jeremy: performing
[00:20:30] Jeremy: as well.
[00:20:31] Jeremy: And I've been on that side as well.
[00:20:33] Jeremy: A couple of
[00:20:33] Jeremy: other things here. how do you see AI playing a role in fundraising?
[00:20:38] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Wow. That's so interesting. In several ways. I think one is with support. now, I don't necessarily have evidence of all of these things.
[00:20:47] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: These are some of the ways that I kind of use AI outside of my professional work, but customer support and engagement. I think adding Other components to be able to talk to folks, teach them, about the organization [00:21:00] answer frequently asked questions. I think that would be awesome.
[00:21:03] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I was speaking about data earlier. This. Could be scary to some and it is it can be a scary frontier right because our roles have been defined for so many years But I feel like there's some opportunities in the data kind of the data mining space We have these huge kind of clunky databases that we've been working with for years trying to get reports and things out of those I'm hoping that AI can evolve some of those things Testing.
[00:21:29] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I have been in recent benchmarking meetings and I'm hearing that people are doing, more integrated testing on their forms, ask strings and things like that. And of course there's content and copywriting, which is very interesting. I think there is an opportunity for us to maybe save money, maybe engage, maybe streamline processes and short, shorten processes.
[00:21:55] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I think AI definitely is going to be integrated into the [00:22:00] nonprofit space. I hope so. I
[00:22:01] Jeremy: Yeah. I think the copywriting
[00:22:03] Jeremy: piece is a really big one, whether
[00:22:05] Jeremy: it's social media posts or
[00:22:07] Jeremy: emails.
[00:22:07] Jeremy: I've led a couple of workshops
[00:22:09] Jeremy: that talked about AI and social media content.
[00:22:12] Jeremy: And one of
[00:22:13] Jeremy: the workshop tasks that I do is we're
[00:22:15] Jeremy: taking 20 minutes. If
[00:22:17] Jeremy: you don't have a chat GPT
[00:22:18] Jeremy: account, set one up right now during this
[00:22:21] Jeremy: workshop. And we're going to talk through
[00:22:23] Jeremy: some
[00:22:23] Jeremy: prompts to create some content for you.
[00:22:26] Jeremy: And I'm always
[00:22:27] Jeremy: recommending.
[00:22:28] Jeremy: don't just take what it says and post it
[00:22:31] Jeremy: or
[00:22:31] Jeremy: take what the
[00:22:32] Jeremy: email says and write it.
[00:22:34] Jeremy: but
[00:22:35] Jeremy: it's going to
[00:22:35] Jeremy: probably have, depending on how well your prompt
[00:22:37] Jeremy: is,
[00:22:37] Jeremy: maybe 50 to 70
[00:22:39] Jeremy: percent of the writing
[00:22:40] Jeremy: done for you. And you still have to
[00:22:41] Jeremy: do
[00:22:41] Jeremy: some critical thinking around
[00:22:42] Jeremy: it,
[00:22:43] Jeremy: There's this
[00:22:43] Jeremy: fear that,
[00:22:45] Jeremy: all the jobs are going to
[00:22:46] Jeremy: go because AI is taking over.
[00:22:48] Jeremy: But if you're an experienced
[00:22:49] Jeremy: copywriter and experienced fundraiser,
[00:22:51] Jeremy: That
[00:22:52] Jeremy: skillset is still valuable because you know how to
[00:22:54] Jeremy: prompt the right
[00:22:55] Jeremy: questions.
[00:22:56] Jeremy: And If you see
[00:22:58] Jeremy: whatever chat GPT
[00:22:59] Jeremy: returns, [00:23:00] you know how
[00:23:00] Jeremy: to refine that to make
[00:23:02] Jeremy: it the copy that you need to
[00:23:03] Jeremy: work for your organization.
[00:23:06] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Exactly. Yeah. And in addition to the copywriting, like we said, there's so many other ways that AI is being integrated into our day to day work, even some of the project management processes as well.
[00:23:16] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I think it's creating new opportunities and people lean into it. It's evolving our jobs and we'll create new opportunities as well. We can't run from it. It's here. It looks like it's here to stay.
[00:23:26] Jeremy: exactly.
[00:23:27] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: as well embrace it and try to be innovative.
[00:23:29] Jeremy: it's all a race right now. And I think the quicker that you learn these tools and learn how to use it with your organization, the better you're setting your organization up for success. And the ones that don't do it, they're going to continue to lag behind is my opinion.
[00:23:44] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Yeah. And we're creating a I guess you could call it a tiger team or a work group now just collaborating with others, some of our cybersecurity people within the organization, because we're all growing and learning some of this at the same time.
[00:23:56] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: We're coming to them with our ideas. We're collaborating with them to [00:24:00] help them develop policies and security policies. Cause again, there's always that security
[00:24:04] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: piece.
[00:24:04] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And I'm learning more and more about that every day. Hey, there's a new fun tool, but like, where's the data going? Or where does the data sit as folks interact with some of these AI pieces?
[00:24:13] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: We're learning and building relationships and locking arms on the whole idea of it.
[00:24:17] Jeremy: Yeah. And that's such an important consideration with AI and it doesn't matter what size you are. you can still be vulnerable to security and even liabilities and lawsuits. Your privacy policy will likely need
[00:24:30] Jeremy: to be updated, even if you're a teeny tiny
[00:24:32] Jeremy: nonprofit.
[00:24:34] Jeremy: But that, that,
[00:24:34] Jeremy: all AI all
[00:24:35] Jeremy: kind of dips into innovation.
[00:24:37] Jeremy: There's many forms of innovation, whether
[00:24:38] Jeremy: it's testing or
[00:24:39] Jeremy: doing different digital channels,
[00:24:41] Jeremy: what advice would you give to nonprofits about innovation
[00:24:45] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: it's interesting when I think about innovation, I think about a lot of organizations really will need to consider a cultural shift.
[00:24:53] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And we don't think about that piece. It's really developing that appetite for innovation. A lot of folks are [00:25:00] and this is probably scary to some, but, think strictly ROI and the cost to raise a dollar. The innovation. piece often exists outside of that. You don't always have those direct answers.
[00:25:11] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: There's also attribution issues, with some of the innovative pieces. I would say start to have conversations, especially when you have folks that are more tenured or more senior in their careers and some of the nonprofit spaces. You got to socialize the idea of it, and then I would say start to develop an innovation budget, acknowledging that the technology is moving forward.
[00:25:32] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: You have to dedicate some budget and some resources, even if it's small to growth because you got to invest to see, what's going to work and try different things.
[00:25:42] Jeremy: thank you for
[00:25:42] Jeremy: saying
[00:25:43] Jeremy: that. cause I've
[00:25:44] Jeremy: said
[00:25:44] Jeremy: that in,
[00:25:45] Jeremy: in this
[00:25:45] Jeremy: season so it's good. I'm not the only crazy person
[00:25:47] Jeremy: out here saying. have an
[00:25:49] Jeremy: innovation budget. That's such a hard selling though, isn't it?
[00:25:52] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It It is. you know, I've gone almost my whole career not having one. We're venturing into a new space because a lot of us are being [00:26:00] drugged into that space, right?
[00:26:01] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: If we don't innovate and evolve, we're going to get left behind. You just got to do your best as far as managing the budget. And often the budget is shifting between channels. In most organizations, I don't want to make an assumption, but in most the mail and telemarketing and the offline channels may have the bigger budget.
[00:26:18] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: You got to make friends with those folks. And the good thing about digital is the cost of raising dollars often less. And sometimes at least Inhabitats case in the last, a few organizations that I've worked with the donation port per donor is a little bit higher. You just you have to look at things from different angles, not just the traditional angle is what I would say.
[00:26:40] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And then just watch it closely. We constantly have companies pitching us new ways to raise money and different things like that, just put parameters around that. Do a 30 day test, a 60 day test, a 90 day test. There are less expensive ways to dip a toe in the water.
[00:26:57] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: And then once you try that out, see how it [00:27:00] goes, then, you can dip into expansion, just keep your eye on the cost to raise a dollar, but give yourself a little room to play. That's what I would
[00:27:06] Jeremy: Yeah. Now, such an
[00:27:08] Jeremy: important piece. if you're listening to the podcast, hit that little
[00:27:11] Jeremy: button that says
[00:27:11] Jeremy: minus ten seconds
[00:27:13] Jeremy: Two or three times and re listen to
[00:27:15] Jeremy: what
[00:27:15] Jeremy: Vernicia just said. Save budget
[00:27:17] Jeremy: to
[00:27:17] Jeremy: innovate.
[00:27:18] Jeremy: last question I Have for you
[00:27:20] Jeremy: here
[00:27:20] Jeremy: is when we think about nonprofits of
[00:27:22] Jeremy: any size,
[00:27:24] Jeremy: what is one
[00:27:24] Jeremy: thing that you would recommend
[00:27:26] Jeremy: that they would incorporate into their
[00:27:28] Jeremy: digital fundraising
[00:27:29] Jeremy: plan?
[00:27:30] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I would say probably creating a integrated campaign calendar. I think a lot of nonprofits notoriously have like separate budgets and separate communication strategies and everybody's doing their best to meet their budget.
[00:27:46] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: But I think, Working in silos can be dangerous, especially in this day and time, especially with the fact that donors, may receive something in the mail and then they go online and fulfill or they see something on TV and they go online and fulfill and, all of [00:28:00] that.
[00:28:00] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It seems simple, but a lot of folks just don't do it, once you regularly review that calendar across the different channels, you will see opportunities that are right there. Most of the time they're right there, opportunities to get more recurring donors, opportunities to collaborate and get major matches for your organization and things like that.
[00:28:20] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: I love the fact that opportunities bubble up to the top when you do an integrated plan across channels.
[00:28:26] Jeremy: Yeah, no, that makes a lot of
[00:28:28] Jeremy: sense because you discover blind
[00:28:30] Jeremy: spots
[00:28:30] Jeremy: as an organization
[00:28:32] Jeremy: that you don't necessarily notice if you're just doing digital or just doing direct mail.
[00:28:36] Jeremy: I'm
[00:28:37] Jeremy: huge proponent of that. and the messaging needs to be the same
[00:28:39] Jeremy: because
[00:28:40] Jeremy: you've probably seen
[00:28:41] Jeremy: this throughout your
[00:28:41] Jeremy: career, how the
[00:28:42] Jeremy: digital
[00:28:43] Jeremy: creative will look
[00:28:44] Jeremy: one way. The
[00:28:45] Jeremy: direct mail will look one way. The billboards
[00:28:47] Jeremy: and
[00:28:47] Jeremy: everything else will look
[00:28:48] Jeremy: different.
[00:28:49] Jeremy: We need to bring it all
[00:28:50] Jeremy: together and
[00:28:50] Jeremy: everyone needs to
[00:28:51] Jeremy: talk
[00:28:51] Jeremy: and make sure
[00:28:52] Jeremy: we're
[00:28:52] Jeremy: planning this together really for the good of the organization
[00:28:54] Jeremy: and the impact that you're looking to have.
[00:28:56] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Absolutely. That's also where the innovation budget [00:29:00] can bubble up, right? Because you can find these little gaps. You can say, okay, I'm doing this campaign and here's the return. And then you can see in the mail and you might say, wow, I think maybe we can lower that cost to raise a dollar if we shift this budget elsewhere.
[00:29:12] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: It really leads to broader conversations. And to your point for the betterment of the organization, for sure.
[00:29:18] Jeremy: good points. Well, we've come to the point.
[00:29:20] Jeremy: of the
[00:29:21] Jeremy: podcast where I'm breaking out the
[00:29:22] Jeremy: clarity
[00:29:23] Jeremy: cards,
[00:29:24] Jeremy: And these are the cards to help with personal and
[00:29:27] Jeremy: professional
[00:29:28] Jeremy: development.
[00:29:29] Jeremy: It's a stack of cards, just a
[00:29:30] Jeremy: bunch of
[00:29:30] Jeremy: questions
[00:29:31] Jeremy: going through them and you learn more about yourself. And I like to learn more about
[00:29:34] Jeremy: my
[00:29:34] Jeremy: guests. I'm going to pull a card.
[00:29:36] Jeremy: And for you,
[00:29:37] Jeremy: your card says, what role does gratitude play in
[00:29:41] Jeremy: your life?
[00:29:42] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Gratitude helps me kind of ride the wave of life. There have been so many ups and downs especially with the pandemic.
[00:29:50] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: There are certainly challenges, although I love the work. There are definitely challenges working in a nonprofit space. I try to focus on gratitude. [00:30:00] just to make sure that I understand what's most important in life. Don't get hampered down with every little detail or things that may not go my way.
[00:30:07] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: Be grateful that I'm able to do impactful work. That's, I can sleep well at night knowing that there will be a family or families that will be positively impacted. I try to stay grateful and that keeps me centered and focused.
[00:30:20] Jeremy: Yeah
[00:30:21] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: that's what gratitude
[00:30:22] Jeremy: No. That's a great answer.
[00:30:23] Jeremy: Thank you for sharing. if people want to reach out to you, if they just have questions
[00:30:27] Jeremy: or
[00:30:27] Jeremy: comments, what's the best way
[00:30:29] Jeremy: they
[00:30:29] Jeremy: can get a hold of you?
[00:30:30] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: i'm on linkedin. And i'll share my email with you. I would say email linkedin is the best way to get in touch with me for
[00:30:36] Jeremy: sure
[00:30:36] Jeremy: Okay.
[00:30:36] vernicia-respres_1_11-08-2024_140611: sure
[00:30:36] Jeremy: All right. thank you Vernicia
[00:30:38] Jeremy: for joining us on this episode of the
[00:30:40] Jeremy: jeremy.
[00:30:40] Jeremy: Haselwood
[00:30:41] Jeremy: Show. And to the listener, thank
[00:30:43] Jeremy: you for
[00:30:43] Jeremy: tuning in to The Jeremy Haselwood Show. If you enjoyed
[00:30:45] Jeremy: today's
[00:30:46] Jeremy: episode, please
[00:30:47] Jeremy: don't forget to follow or
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[00:30:49] Jeremy: so you can always be up to date when the latest episode drops.
[00:30:52] Jeremy: Until
[00:30:52] Jeremy: next time, keep following your
[00:30:54] Jeremy: dreams to find your purpose.
[00:31:00]
